Ancient Indians – Satya Samhita

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Abhyasa : Jyothi’s Questions : My Answers : Jeevatma,Paramatma, Karma

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Good Morning Satya Garu, 

I hope all is well with you. I was reading and I have a couple of Questions. 
Could you please answer them.
  • I will answer to the best of my present understanding.
These are the Q’s I came across so far in my Quest for the Knowledge of Self.

1. Difference between Aatma and the Jeevudu/ Jeevam / Pranam and Soul.
  • The Atman is the Jeeva. It is the Self.
  • prANa is the out going breath or life breath.
  • Soul is a foreign word and concept, you have to read their books.
2. Jeevatma and paramatma
    If the above two are same where does Karma come in to place/picture.
  • Dvaitins and Visishtadavatins do not agree that Jeevatma and Paramatma are the same. They strongly believe in karma that follows you after death.
  • Advaitins believe that  Jeevatma and Paramatma are the same, but that there is an illusion that makes you feel that they are different. As long as you are under the influence of maya you are exactly like a dvaitin. For example I think I am Satya and you are Jyothi. But one day (hopefully)I will see that what I take for reality – this jagat is mithyam an illusion and that brahman is the reality. That day, all my sanchita karma (accumulated karma) gets destroyed.. ie it ceases to exist.! “I can’t hurt or help you, because you are I”.. some such thing. So no karma.
3. How are the papa and punya related to the aatma.
   For ex: We have aatma, and its pure, so who is the karta and who decides right or wrong and there by  accumulate papa or punya  ..
               What is the entity that gets papa and punya..
               And if aatma is the one that changes the body after body, which is uneffected by the papa and punya (karma phalam) 
               then on what basis does the aatma enter a rich body or poor body or a diseased body or healthy body.. (as they say its dependent on karma.. papa and punyam)
               how is that basis related and attached to the aatma.
  • Advaita says that Once you recognise that the karta (doer) is the pure paramatma, the sense of right and wrong, good and bad, sinner and saint, this and the other fall away. I am Annaji and I am G. Janardhan Reddy. Thus all beings and all bodies, the entire universe is I! Aham brahmaasmi!!
  • Dvaita disagrees. Dvaita says that Annaji who is pure and devout will get a good place near bhagvaan and G.J. Reddy will have to pay in either this birth or next birth for his illegal deeds. I being not as good as the one or as bad as the other will have a future dependent on my deeds. While God Rules over all, we have a bit where we can choose and act as per our will. We do what we are ordered by God, we do somethings we want and we collect the karma where we have responsibility.
4. General interpretation.. Its Gods play, and we are all his puppets… and its our karma.. and hence our life..and we cant do anything.. its all in his control.. 
    If we as Aatma – jeevatma and paramatma are equal why do we have miseries.. and how can the above statement be validated… ?
  • You have karma only to the extent that you recognise your kartrutvam (doership). Dvaitins and on-the-way-advaitins recognise kartrutvam. Complete Advaitins do not identify with their individual body, mind or actions, but with the parmatma. The world looks different to them. In a sense they have the ultimate kartrutvam of the paramatma.
5.  Aatma is the only thing.and .everything that we should understand and know about… then if we are thinking about Aatma and my stomach is aching then.. how can 
    I not acknowledge the pain.. its still my body.. thought its not the aatma and its in pain right..
    How should I understand this difference and acknowledge and accept it. 
  • Pain is the nerves telling your brain that your stomach needs attention. When you take a medicine, the dvaitin would say that you took it. The advaitin would say that paramatma gave medicine to a bit of itself.
  • When my body sweeps the floor, my mind expresses gratitude to the paramatma for giving me a clean floor. This is how I deal with it.
  • When I see an Afghan terrorist, I see the world order which created him of which I am also a part. When I see Annaji,  I see the world order which created him of which I am also a part. I accept all the sins and virtues of the world. I accept all the accomplishments of the universe as mine. My mind feels grateful to paramAtma, when this body or mind is used to sing or do what my my mind has classified as “good”. Think of Tagore’s Gitanjali.
  • A colleague once gave me a great example : you think you are in this cubicle. But these few square feet are also a part of the universe.
6. Desire:  As said below:    The seven great enemies we have are Desire, Anger, Greed, Lust, Pride, Envy and Fear, which cause Maya in us – will not touch the person who has attained to the ATMA JNANAM. He is always joyful. Having said that… I desire to know about the self/Atma.. so this is a desire.. and if its my enemy, how can I deal with it..It has become confusing and complicated.
  • You are a mumukshu. One who desires to be free, moksha. To you those seven are enemies. They are friends for those who wish material achievements and pleasures. Anger and Desire and Fear, cloud your brain, as you and I have observed. A clouded mind can be manipulated and cannot see Reality. Your desire for moksha is an enemy in material pursuits. It will not let you tell lies. It will not let you amass wealth etc. It will bring you in conflict with samsaara. So pray to Mahamaya, pray to Devi. I find this is a big help. since I am and on-the-way-advaitin. Some minds in this universe are attracted to advaita, some to dvaita and some to samsaara.

7. How to find happiness within ? 

  • This reminds me of Kung Fu Panda (“Inner Peace”)! It is a process in my view that is gradually achieved. But both my guruji’s say that it can happen in an instant. A word, a glance, a thought.
  • My mind feels happy in temples and in my balcony because that is where I can leave of samsaara though I am in it and ponder on Sri Maha Vishnu (or Ganesha or Siva or Devi).
  • Human Interactions make me increasingly unhappy.
  • Your chosen sadhana will help you focus on God instead of samsaara. That will give you happiness. Yogis search for “That” in their hearts. Vishnu is yogi- hrut-dhyana-gamyam. Such meditation, or parayanam or other way may help you.

8. Why am I created ??? Again and again.. as if one janma was not enough and accumulating papa and punyam.. janma after janma..

  • Something tells me that you have attained vairagya or detachment from samsaara. You are already a mumukshu. I think you should read Viveka Chuda Mani of Adi Sankaracharya. That is your best guide.

why why why ??? I only had the papa and punya because I was created and ignorant right? Before my first janma I had no papa and punya right, so why was I did I have my first janma which lead to all these janmas/rebirths ?? How to break through this ?? After knowing all these what should I do, whats next ? I am so confused and need help.

  • This questions is argued by Sri Ramanujacharya in his commentary Sri Bhasyaon the Badarayana Vyasa Vedanta Sutras.
  • I am not convinced by his answer but any Sri Vaishnavite scholar will help you with that answer.
  • As I said before, intellectually, I don’t recognise papa and punya. Only karma as a sadhana to attaining advaita.
  • Adi Sankaracharya said, sat sangatve nissangatvam. From attachment to good, do I go to detachment. This is why I like Anna Hazaare better than Corruption. Annaji reinstills the desire and strength in me to be pure, selfless and detached even while participating in samsaara. This will help me on my way to Advaita.
  • I let Ganesha know very firmly this Vinayaka Chavithi, that I am not interested in punarapi maranam, punarapi jananam, punarapi jannai jatare sayanam. (.. death, birth, womb occupation). Then I begged “iha samsaare khalu dussare krupaya paare” – Save me with your grace.
  • pAhi murAre! Save me O Krishna!
  • Bhaja Govindam! Worship Krishna!
  • aham tvam sarva papebhyo mokshayishyami maa sucha – Gita – Krishna will free you.
  • I recommend that you read my work on the Gita and Tat Tvam Asi and Isa Upanishad, on this site. Then with that introduction, you can read the originals.
I am thankful to you for reading this email till the end.
  • I hope my answers helped you and gave you some clarity.
  • I hope they help others too. That’s why I put them on my blog!
Lots of love,
Satya
Authorship and Copyright Notice : All Rights Reserved : Satya Sarada Kandula
Philosophy

Upanishads

Written by Satya

September 7, 2011 at 9:49 am

Hara Hara Mahadeva!

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